Post by email@example.com Post by fasgnadh Post by firstname.lastname@example.org Post by Mike Painter Post by fasgnadh
So I'm working on my car and not paying any particular attention
to my next-door neighbors who are hanging out on their back porch
and chatting with a friend. They're about 40 feet away and voices
carry pretty clearly.
"It is utterly impossible for anyone to be an 'atheist'! You can
BELIEVE you're one, but you're really not because everyone's got a
god, whether it's Gawd or TV or themselves."
YOur neighbours are smarter than you, they must have been reading my
posts carefully logging all the forms of closet theism among atheists;
- Athei-Buddhists, like Mark Richo and the others who believe in Karma,
re-incarnation, deva's, demigods and follow the One who Walked on
Water, just like Jesus!!! BD
# "it makes utterly no difference which goddesses or gods
# you believe in, as long as you have some...
# Me, I'd suggest Bastet." - Cary Kittrell
# (has he misspelled 'Kitten'? ;-)
So in your mind there is no difference between a man,
a TV, or the gods of any religion,
Oh no, I can tell the difference.. you are reading the
product of ATHEISTS minds! B^D Smartarse's neighbour
merely accurately described how atheists BELIEVE a whole
range if idiotic nonsense, and i provided proof that was the case.
You seem to think that there is no difference between eating an apple
and eating dog shit because in both cases you are EATING!!! B^D
Clearly you are making a significant error in logical discrimination!!!
I don't share any of your idiotic beliefs.. I have merely DOCUMENTED
them ...so everyone can have a good laugh!
Logic really is not your forte, is it.. and from what we see
in self-contradictory atheist beliefs, your confusion
and irrational lack of logic is the norm among atheists;
Here's some more atheist beliefs.. they just get sillier and sillier;
Post by Mike Painter Post by fasgnadh
- Atheist worshippers of Poseidon, Thor and other Norse and Roman gods
"I have poured a libation, and slaughtered a fattened calf,
placing its thighs on a thick layer of fat and burning
it in the fire, enabling me to send a prayer
for you to the Almighty Earthshaker, the Girdler of
the World, Poseidon Lord of the Seas."
'I'd like a Viking funeral" - Raven1
- Those who reveal their closet theism by blaming God everytime
something BAD happens (but are blind to all the Good in the World;-)
Mark Richo, Bukakke and a host of other low IQ, conflicted believers !
- The 'anti-atheist' members of just plain nutty cults;
Published as part of the Official "Atheist Quote of the Month" liturgy
# Subject: aa - The Polls are Open! AQOTM for Nov 2008
# Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 08:10:11 -0500
# 1) The universe is ruled by a wizard, a zombie, and a ghost.
# Only the ghost is with us now, even though
# the zombie shacks up in our gall bladders and the wizard
# is omnipresent. You'll want to stay on the wizard's good
# side, because he has this thing for the aroma of
# flame-broiled human flesh. Oh, and this ripple and
# this Wheat Thin will turn into chunks of the zombie
# if a designated wizard's apprentice casts a spell on them.
# Thus enchanted, the cracker can be used to reveal the
# true demonic nature of Jews, much as a garlic pizza
# could out vampires (if we believed in such things,
# which we don't cuz that would be silly, dontcha know).
# We know these things to be true despite having not
# one damn reason to believe any of them.
# Authior By: DuhIdiot (Atheist )
# Nominated: Christopher A Lee (Atheist )
# Seconded: AZ Nomad (Atheist )
# Supported by the following card-carrying
# DuhIdiot (Atheist )
# Christopher A Lee (Atheist )
# AZ Nomad (Atheist )
# Robibnikoff (Atheist )
# Kilmir (Atheist )
# Smiler (Atheist )
# Douglas Berry (Atheist )
# pbamvv (Atheist )
# Uncle Vic (Atheist )
# johac (Atheist )
# Louis 14 (Atheist )
# Frank Mayhar (Atheist )
# Tim McGauchy (Atheist )
# Vipera Berus (Atheist )
"When people stop believing in God, they don't believe in nothing
Now, be honest ..all you atheists who have seen what your
fellow believers believe in.. have you ever seen a bigger
hodge-podge of idiotic claptrap!!??!!!!!! B^D
Does any of it make ANY sense?
Post by Mike Painter
much less that of the major religions?
Post by Mike Painter
Makes for a good movie title
"Atheist Pussies worship Bastet"? B^D
"Atheist Arseholes Hammered by Thor" B^D
"Atheist Dogma run over by athei-Buddhist Kar, Ma!"
Post by Mike Painter
Mothra can be in the next one.
Sure, you couldn't make atheism any MORE INCOHERENT than it already is!
Post by Mike Painter
Thta's right up there with Pastor Frank.
Oh you poor boy.. I hope he used lots of lube on you!?
Does your arse need many stiches?
I hear you ex-choirboys call him Father In!
Post by Mike Painter Post by fasgnadh
I give up.
Most atheists do.. once they grow up past adolescence and learn
something about the history of atheist regimes, they wake up!
I'm not going to argue for custody of Doook or the other
trolls--if I'm not really an atheist, they don't matter anyway,
Most atheists are not really atheists, it just takes them a while
to realise their unhappiness comes from the strain of trying to
reconcile their contradictions.. what is amusing is how the die-hards,
realising they are as miserable as Soviet and Maoist atheists, try
to perpetuate their illusion by pretending the happiness of others
is 'false' happiness; B^D
Dude, when you start rationalisng their own misery and despair like
that you KNOW that Jung was right!
"Among all my patients in the second half of life, that is, over
thirty-five, there has not been one whose problem in the last
resort was not that of finding a religious outlook on life.
It is safe to say that every one of them fell ill because
he had lost that which the living religions of every age
have given their followers, and none of them has really
been healed who did not regain his religious outlook."
-Carl G. Jung Modern Man in Search of a Soul
Who wants my rubber chicken?
Have you washed the KY jelly off it?
Faithless Atheist abandons life-partner to Porn Industry!
"A VIDEO depicting degrading sex acts filmed in the rooms
of the North Melbourne Football Club and posted online
by one of the side's young footballers is being investigated
by the club.
North Melbourne chief executive Eugene Arocca said last
night he was "embarrassed" about the four-minute movie
that depicts sex acts by a toy rubber chicken — being
manoeuvred by an unidentifiable human hand — in a supermarket,
a pub toilet and in the club's locker rooms and offices."
Smartass! How could you!
Oh the Humanity!
"Throughout the video, which was posted on YouTube, the
toy chicken has a condom on its head and is manipulated to
look as if it is penetrating the carcass of a real chicken
that also features throughout the film."
So far it's just just a normal Sunday at Atheist house! B^D
"The real chicken seemingly plays the role of a woman."
Well, real women won't let atheists pollute the gene pool
by swimming in it.. B^D ..they have to rely on surrogates.
Tim Minchin even wrote a song about Atheist Love;
"The storyline becomes increasingly menacing as the two characters
go to the pub — he has beer, she has white wine — and end up
having sex in the toilet.
The final scenes show the real chicken carcass being hurled
against a wall, then run over by a van before the rubber
chicken returns and simulates fornication again.
The backing track is Move Bitch by American rapper Ludacris."
"the video, The Adventures of Little Boris, .. found its way onto
YouTube. It's now been removed. I'm furious to say the least that it's
gotten out, though I haven't had the advantage of seeing it."
AFL corporate affairs manager Brian Walsh saw the video and last night
described it as "infantile and inappropriate".
What do you expect of people whose Significant Other
us a Rubber Chickens? B^D
"It just bristles with degradation of women. Don't they get it?"
"a video that's just plain misogynistic. It's just full of women hatred
— women are to be belittled, to be raped and to be degraded. It's sick."
The most terrifying part for the pornographers is...
all the perverts involved are being checked for Atheist STD's! 8^o
Post by Mike Painter Post by fasgnadh
And who wants to go to Easter services with me?
After the way you abandoned your Rubber Chick to the vile clutches of
the bestial pornographers, no one does!!!! B^[
Trust the resident hysteric
Oh no, we never believe a word Chris Lee says!
He would have fucked the chick with a drill chuck!
# Newsgroups: alt.religion.christian.pentecostal,alt.atheism
# Subject: Re: Merry Christmas
# Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 16:24:01 -0500
# "go fuck yourself with your crucifix in a drill chuck'.
Clearly that violent sexual psychopath was abused as a chick.
<snip unevidenced Blog rant>
You don't appear to understand what EVIDENCE means, let me show you;
Post by email@example.com
Here is the bit which embarrassed
I should think you would be embarrassed, or at least you
will be when you realise that ignoring the 40,000,000 victims
of the Atheist tyrannies - the Union of Savage Slaughter
and Repression(USSR), the Great Leap Backward and the Cultural
Devolution just makes this UNSUBSTANTIATED ATHEIST OPINION look
as ridiculous as you for swallowing it without any PROOF;
Post by firstname.lastname@example.org
"...higher rates of belief in and worship of a creator correlate with
higher rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD
infection rates, teen pregnancy, and abortion in the prosperous
Utter baldadash! Where's the proof you were asked for, you fraud!?
Below is a PARTIAL list of the terror, torture and MURDER committed
by just two of the Atheist Regimes in the past Century. These were
OFFICIAL Atheist States, run by Atheist tyrants, implementing Atheist
"Atheism is the natural and inseparable part of Communism."
-Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov (Lenin)
"Our program necessarily includes the propaganda of atheism."
- Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov (Lenin)
"How can you make a revolution without firing squads?"
Once you have recovered from the shock of seeing what ACTUAL HISTORICAL
EVIDENCE looks like, and have realised your BELIEFS aren't worth shit
without the EVIDENCE you were dismissed for failing to provide,
and feel mortified that you are shown to be an irrational cretin
asking people to take your drivel on BLIND FAITH, and that the
historical evidence I am providing you is irrefutable, you will have
1. Stick your head up your arse like every other atheist has done
in the face of the historical evidence of atheist tyranny, snip
it, run away, deny it exists, and then never respond to my posts
except to whine that I keep rubbing your noses in it!
2. Find evidence of over 40,000,000 dead as a direct result of
theocracies in the same time period. (there are none, atheism
is far and away THE MOST DEADLY AND DYSFUNCTIONAL OF ALL
POLITICAL PERVERSIONS! )
3, develop a headache, complain there are too many facts, or you
have to get your hair done, and fuck off never to be seen in
I am predicting (1) or (3) B^]
First, Lenin's Red Terror, Atheism in praxis;
# Russian Civil War (1917-22): 9 000 000 [make link]
* Eckhardt: 500,000 civ. + 300,000 mil. = 800,000
* Readers Companion to Military History, Cowley and Parker, eds.
o Combat deaths: 825,000
o Ancillary deaths: 2,000,000
o TOTAL: 2,825,000
* Davies, Norman (Europe A History, 1998)
o Civil War and Volga Famine (1918-22): 3,000,000 to 5,000,000
* Brzezinski, Z:
o 6 to 8 million people died under Lenin from war, famine etc.
* Mastering Twentieth Century Russian History by Norman Lowe (2002)
o TOTAL: 7,000,000 to 10,000,000
o Red Army
+ Battle: 632,000
+ Disease: 581,000
o Whites: 1,290,000 battle + disease
o White Terror: "tens of thousands"
o Red Terror
+ Executed: 50-200,000
+ Died in prison or killed in revolts: 400,000
o Typhoid + typhus
+ 1919: 890,000
+ 1920: >1M
o Military deaths: 800,000
+ Battle deaths, all sides: 300,000
+ Dead of wounds: 50,000
+ Disease: 450,000
o Civilians: 8,000,000
o TOTAL: 8,800,000
* Dyadkin, I.G. (cited in Adler, N., Victims of Soviet Terror, 1993)
o 9 million unnatural deaths from terror, famine and disease,
* Richard Pipes, A concise history of the Russian Revolution
(1995): 9 million deaths, 1917-1922
o Famine: 5M
o Combat: 2M
+ Reds: 1M
+ Whites: 127,000
o Epidemics: 2M
o not incl.
+ Emigration: 2M
+ Birth deficit: 14M
o Civil War (1917-22)
+ War: 1,410,000 (includes 500,000 civilian)
+ Famine: 5,000,000 (50% democidal)
+ Other democide: 784,000
+ Epidemics: 2,300,000
+ Total: 9,494,000
o Lenin's Regime (1917-24)
+ Rummel blames Lenin for a lifetime total of 4,017,000
* Figes, Orlando (A People's Tragedy: A History of the Russian
o 10 million deaths from war, terror, famine and disease.
# Famine (1921-22): 5 million
# Killed in fighting, both military and civilian: 1M
# Jews killed in pogroms: 150,000
+ Not including...
# Demographic effects of a hugely reduced
# Emmigration: 2M
* McEvedy, Colin (Atlas of World Population History, 1978)
o War deaths: 2M
o Other excess deaths: 14M
o Reduced births: 10M
o Emmigration: 2M
* MEDIAN: Of these ten estimates that claim to be complete, the
median is 8.8M-9.0M.
o Small & Singer (battle deaths, 1917-21)
+ Russian Civil War (Dec.1917-Oct.1920)
# Russians: 500,000
# Allied Intervention:
* Japan: 1,500
* UK: 350
* USA: 275
* France: 50
* Finland: 50
+ Russian Nationalities War (Dec.1917-Mar.1921)
# USSR: 50,000
o Bruce Lincoln, Red Victory: a History of the Russian Civil
+ Death sentences by the Cheka: ca. 100,000
+ Pogroms: as many as one in 13 Jews k. out of 1.5M in
Ukraine [i.e. ca. 115,000] (citing Heifetz)
o Nevins, citing Heifetz and the Red Cross: 120,000 Jews
killed in 1919 pogroms [http://www.west.net/~jazz/felshtin/redcross.html]
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): Cheka responsible for
maybe 250,000+ violent deaths.
o Paul Johnson
+ 50,000 death sentences imposed by the Cheka by 12/20
+ 100,000 Jews killed in 1919
o Green, Barbara (in Rosenbaum, Is the Holocaust Unique?)
+ 4 to 5 million deaths in the famine of 1921-23
o Max Boot, The Savage Wars of Peace
+ North Russia: 244 USAns d. incl. 144 k.battle
+ Siberia: 160 USAns KIA + 168 other d.
+ [US Total: 304 KIA + 268 other = 572 d.]
+ Czech Legion: 13,000 dead.
# Soviet Union, Stalin's regime (1924-53): 20 000 000 [make link]
* There are basically two schools of thought when it comes to the
number who died at Stalin's hands. There's the "Why doesn't anyone
realize that communism is the absolutely worst thing ever to hit the
human race, without exception, even worse than both world wars, the
slave trade and bubonic plague all put together?" school, and there's
the "Come on, stop exaggerating. The truth is horrifying enough without
you pulling numbers out of thin air" school. The two schools are
generally associated with the right and left wings of the political
spectrum, and they often accuse each other of being blinded by
prejudice, stubbornly refusing to admit the truth, and maybe even having
a hidden agenda. Also, both sides claim that recent access to former
Soviet archives has proven that their side is right.
* Here are a few illustrative estimates from the Big Numbers school:
o Adler, N., Victims of Soviet Terror, 1993 cites these:
+ Chistyakovoy, V. (Neva, no.10): 20 million killed
during the 1930s.
+ Dyadkin, I.G. (Demograficheskaya statistika
neyestestvennoy smertnosti v SSSR 1918-1956 ): 56 to 62 million
"unnatural deaths" for the USSR overall, with 34 to 49 million under Stalin.
+ Gold, John.: 50-60 million.
o Davies, Norman (Europe A History, 1998): c. 50 million
killed 1924-53, excluding WW2 war losses. This would divide (more or
less) into 33M pre-war and 17M after 1939.
o Rummel, 1990: 61,911,000 democides in the USSR 1917-87, of
which 51,755,000 occurred during the Stalin years. This divides up into:
+ 1923-29: 2,200,000 (plus 1M non-democidal famine deaths)
+ 1929-39: 15,785,000 (plus 2M non-democidal famine)
+ 1939-45: 18,157,000
+ 1946-54: 15,613,000 (plus 333,000 non-democidal famine)
+ TOTAL: 51,755,000 democides and 3,333,000 non-demo.
o William Cockerham, Health and Social Change in Russia and
Eastern Europe: 50M+
o Wallechinsky: 13M (1930-32) + 7M (1934-38)
+ Cited by Wallechinsky:
# Medvedev, Roy (Let History Judge): 40 million.
# Solzhenitsyn, Aleksandr: 60 million.
o MEDIAN: 51 million for the entire Stalin Era; 20M during
* And from the Lower Numbers school:
o Nove, Alec ("Victims of Stalinism: How Many?" in J. Arch
Getty (ed.) Stalinist Terror: New Perspectives, 1993): 9,500,000
"surplus deaths" during the 1930s.
o Cited in Nove:
+ Maksudov, S. (Poteri naseleniya SSSR, 1989): 9.8
million abnormal deaths between 1926 and 1937.
+ Tsaplin, V.V. ("Statistika zherty naseleniya v 30e
gody" 1989): 6,600,000 deaths (hunger, camps and prisons) between the
1926 and 1937 censuses.
+ Dugin, A. ("Stalinizm: legendy i fakty" 1989):
642,980 counterrevolutionaries shot 1921-53.
+ Muskovsky Novosti (4 March 1990): 786,098 state
prisoners shot, 1931-53.
o Gordon, A. (What Happened in That Time?, 1989, cited in
Adler, N., Victims of Soviet Terror, 1993): 8-9 million during the 1930s.
o Ponton, G. (The Soviet Era, 1994): cites an 1990 article by
Milne, et al., that excess deaths 1926-39 were likely 3.5 million and at
most 8 million.
o MEDIAN: 8.5 Million during the 1930s.
* As you can see, there's no easy compromise between the two
schools. The Big Numbers are so high that picking the midpoint between
the two schools would still give us a Big Number. It may appear to be a
rather pointless argument -- whether it's fifteen or fifty million, it's
still a huge number of killings -- but keep in mind that the population
of the Soviet Union was 164 million in 1937, so the upper estimates
accuse Stalin of killing nearly 1 out of every 3 of his people, an
extremely Polpotian level of savagery. The lower numbers, on the other
hand, leave Stalin with plenty of people still alive to fight off the
* Although it's too early to be taking sides with absolute
certainty, a consensus seems to be forming around a death toll of 20
million. This would adequately account for all documented nastiness
without straining credulity:
o In The Great Terror (1969), Robert Conquest suggested that
the overall death toll was 20 million at minimum -- and very likely 50%
higher, or 30 million. This would divide roughly as follows: 7M in
1930-36; 3M in 1937-38; 10M in 1939-53. By the time he wrote The Great
Terror: A Re-assessment (1992), Conquest was much more confident that 20
million was the likeliest death toll.
o Britannica, "Stalinism": 20M died in camps, of famine,
executions, etc., citing Medvedev
o Brzezinski: 20-25 million, dividing roughly as follows: 7M
destroying the peasantry; 12M in labor camps; 1M excuted during and
o Daniel Chirot:
+ "Lowest credible" estimate: 20M
+ "Highest": 40M
# Conquest: 20M
# Antonov-Ovseyenko: 30M
# Medvedev: 40M
o Courtois, Stephane, Black Book of Communism (Le Livre Noir
du Communism): 20M for the whole history of Soviet Union, 1917-91.
+ Essay by Nicolas Werth: 15M
+ [Ironic observation: The Black Book of Communism
seems to vote for Hitler as the answer to the question of who's worse,
Hitler (25M) or Stalin (20M).]
o John Heidenrich, How to Prevent Genocide: A Guide for
Policymakers, Scholars, and the Concerned Citizen (2001): 20M, incl.
+ Kulaks: 7M
+ Gulag: 12M
+ Purge: 1.2M (minus 50,000 survivors)
o Adam Hochschild, The Unquiet Ghost: Russians Remember
Stalin: directly responsible for 20 million deaths.
o Tina Rosenberg, The Haunted Land: Facing Europes Ghosts
After Communism (1995): upwards of 25M
o Time Magazine (13 April 1998): 15-20 million.
* AVERAGE: Of the 17 estimates of the total number of victims of
Stalin, the median is 30 million.
* Individual Gulags etc.
* Famine, 1926-38
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): 4.2M in Ukraine + 1.7M
o Green, Barbara ("Stalinist Terror and the Question of
Genocide: the Great Famine" in Rosenbaum, Is the Holocaust Unique?)
cites these sources for the number who died in the famine:
+ Nove: 3.1-3.2M in Ukraine, 1933
+ Maksudov: 4.4M in Ukraine, 1927-38
+ Mace: 5-7M in Ukraine
+ Osokin: 3.35M in USSR, 1933
+ Wheatcraft: 4-5M in USSR, 1932-33
# Total, USSR, 1926-37: 11M
# 1932-33: 7M
# Ukraine: 5M
# Next, just to show it's a CONSISTENT PATTERN in EVERY ATHEIST REGIME,
# Mao's Cultural Devolution and Great Leap Backward!
# People's Republic of China, Mao Zedong's regime (1949-1975):
40 000 000
* Agence France Press (25 Sept. 1999) citing at length from
Courtois, Stephane, Le Livre Noir du Communism:
o Rural purges, 1946-49: 2-5M deaths
o Urban purges, 1950-57: 1M
o Great Leap Forward: 20-43M
o Cultural Revolution: 2-7M
o Labor Camps: 20M
o Tibet: 0.6-1.2M
o TOTAL: 44.5 to 72M
* Jasper Becker, Hungry Ghosts : Mao's Secret Famine (1996)
o Estimates of the death toll from the Great Leap Forward,
+ Judith Banister, China's Changing Population (1984):
30M excess deaths (acc2 Becker: "the most reliable estimate we have")
+ Wang Weizhi, Contemporary Chinese Population (1988):
+ Jin Hui (1993): 40M population loss due to "abnormal
deaths and reduced births"
+ Chen Yizi of the System Reform Inst.: 43-46M deaths
o Forcible collectivization: 27 million peasants
o Cultural Revolution: 1-2 million
o TOTAL: 29 million deaths under Mao
* Daniel Chirot:
o Land reform, 1949-56
+ According to Zhou Enlai: 830,000
+ According to Mao Zedong: 2-3M
o Great Leap Forward: 20-40 million deaths.
o Cultural Revolution: 1-20 million
* Jung Chang, Mao: the Unknown Story (2005)
o Suppression of Counterrevolutionaries, 1950-51:
3M by execution, mob or suicide
o Three-Anti Campaign, 1952-53: 200,000-300,000 suicides
o Great Leap Forward, 1958-61: 38M of starvation and overwork
o Cultural Revolution, 1966-76: > 3M died violent deaths
o Laogai camp deaths, 1949-76: 27M
o TOTAL under Mao: 70M
* Dictionary of 20C World History: around a half million
died in Cultural Rev.
o Govt executes landlords (1950-51): 1,000,000
o Cultural Revolution (1967-68): 50,000
o 1958-61 Famine: 30 million deaths.
* Kurt Glaser and Stephan Possony, Victims of Politics (1979):
o They estimate the body count under Mao to be 38,000,000
o Cited by G & P:
+ Walker Report (see below): 44.3M to 63.8M deaths.
+ The Government Information Office of Taiwan (18 Sept.
1970): 37M deaths in the PRC.
+ A Radio Moscow report (7 Apr. 1969): 26.4M people had
been exterminated in China.
+ (NOTE: Obviously the Soviets and Taiwanese would, as
enemies, be strongly motivated to exaggerate.)
* Guinness Book of World Records:
o Although nowadays they don't come right out and declare Mao
to be the Top Dog in the Mass Killings category, earlier
editions (such as 1978) did, and they cited sources which
are similar, but not identical, to the Glaser & Possony sources:
+ On 7 Apr. 1969 the Soviet government radio reported
that 26,300,000 people were killed in China, 1949-65.
+ In April 1971 the cabinet of the government of Taiwan
reported 39,940,000 deaths for the years 1949-69.
+ The Walker Report (see below): between 32,2500,000
* Harff and Gurr:
o KMT cadre, rich peasants, landlords (1950-51):
o Cultural Revolution (1966-75): 400,000-850,000
* John Heidenrich, How to Prevent Genocide: A Guide for
Policymakers, Scholars, and the Concerned Citizen:
27M death toll, incl. 2M in Cultural Revolution
* Paul Johnson doesn't give an overall total, but he gives
estimates for the principle individual mass dyings of the Mao years:
o Land reform, first years of PRC: at least 2 million people
o Great Leap Forward: "how many millions died ...
is a matter of conjecture."
o Cultural Revolution: 400,000, calling the 3 Feb. 1979
estimate by Agence France Presse, "The most widely respected figure".
* Meisner, Maurice, Mao's China and After (1977, 1999), doesn't
give an overall total either, but he does give estimates for the three
principle mass dyings of the Mao years:
o Terror against the counterrevolutionaries: 2 million people
executed during the first three years of the PRC.
o Great Leap Forward: 15-30 million famine-related deaths.
o Cultural Revolution: 400,000, citing a 1979 estimate by
Agence France Presse.
* R. J. Rummel:
+ Democide: 34,361,000 (1949-75)
# The principle episodes being...
* All movements (1949-58): 11,813,000
o incl. Land Reform (1949-53): 4,500,000
* Cult. Rev. (1964-75): 1,613,000
* Forced Labor (1949-75): 15,000,000
* Great Leap Forward (1959-63): 5,680,000
+ War: 3,399,000
+ Famine: 34,500,000
# Great Leap Forward: 27M famine deaths
+ TOTAL: 72,260,000
o Cited in Rummel:
+ Li, Cheng-Chung (Republic of China, 1979): 78.86M
+ World Anti-Communist League, True Facts of Maoist
Tyranny (1971): 64.5M
+ Glaser & Possony: 38 to 67M (see above)
+ Walker Report, 1971 (see below): 31.75M to 58.5M
casualties of Communism (excluding Korean War).
+ Current Death Toll of International Communism (1979):
+ Stephen R. Shalom (1984), Center for Asian Studies,
Deaths in China Due To Communism: 3M to 4M death toll,
* Walker, Robert L., The Human Cost of Communism in China (1971,
report to the US Senate Committee of the Judiciary)
"Casualties to Communism" (deaths):
o 1st Civil War (1927-36): .25-.5M
o Fighting during Sino-Japanese War (1937-45): 50,000
o 2nd Civil War (1945-49): 1.25M
o Land Reform prior to Liberation: 0.5-1.0M
o Political liquidation campaigns: 15-30M
o Korean War: 0.5-1.234M
o Great Leap Forward: 1-2M
o Struggle with minorities: 0.5-1.0M
o Cultural Revolution: .25-.5M
o Deaths in labor camps: 15-25M
o TOTAL: 34.3M to 63.784M
o TOTAL FOR PRC: 32M to 59.5M
* July 17, 1994, Washington Post (Great Leap Forward 1959-61)
o Shanghai University journal, Society: > 40 million
o Cong Jin: 40 million
o Chen Yizi: 43 million in the famine. 80 million total as a
result of Mao's policies.
* Weekly Standard, 29 Sept. 1997, "The Laogai Archipelago" by D.
o Between 1949 and 1997, 50M prisoners passed through the
labor camps, and 15,000,000 died (citing Harry Wu)
* WHPSI: 1,633,319 political executions and 25,961 deaths from
political violence, 1948-77. TOTAL: 1,659,280
* Analysis: If we line up the 14 sources which claim to be
complete, the median falls in the 45.75 to 52.5 million
range, so you probably can't go wrong picking a final
number from this neighborhood.
Depending on how you want to count some of the incomplete
estimates (such as Becker and Meisner) and whether to count a
source twice (or thrice, as with Walker) if it's referenced by
two different authorities, you can slide the median up and
down the scale by many millions. Keep in mind, however, that
official Chinese records are hidden from scrutiny,
so most of these numbers are pure guesses. It's pointless
to get attached to any one of them, because the real number
could easily be half or twice any number here.
* Perhaps a better way of estimating would be to add up the
individual components. The medians here are:
o Purges, etc. during the first few years: 2M (10 estimates)
o Great Leap Forward: 31-33M (14 estimates)
o Cultural Revolution: 1M (13 estimates)
o Ethnic Minorities, primarily Tibetans: 750-900T
(8 estimates, see below)
o Labor Camps: 20M (5 estimates)
o This produces a total of some 54,750,000 to 56,900,000
deaths. The weak link in this calculation is in the
Labor Camp numbers for which we only have 5 estimates.
* Notice that many early body counts (such as Walker) completely
miss the famine during the Great Leap Forward, which was
largely unknown in the west until around 1980. There are two
contradictory ways to assess those early estimates which
ignore the famine:
1. "If these are the numbers that they came up with without
the famine, imagine how high the true number will be
once you add the famine deaths."
2. "Can we trust any of these numbers? After all, if they
missed such a huge famine, they can't have known very much
about what was going on inside China."
* ... so this line of reasoning will get us nowhere. In fact, the
median of the 7 estimate that predate 1980 is 45.7M, which is
almost the same as the median of the 7 estimates that post-date
1980 -- 58M. (At this scale, a 12M difference counts as "almost
Now, remember, these are the CITIZENS of those atheist shitholes being
killed by the Atheist regimes who made their lives such misery and
despair that when the atheist regimes crumbled from their own evil and
incompetence, the people could not wait to shuck off the filthy atheist
shitpigs and their nightmare.. and embrace a path more tolerant of
religion.. since then their nations have prospered.. still suffering
the deep scars of atheist abuse, but once more part of Civilisation and
Now, all you have to do is show similar EVIDENCE.. not your IDIOTIC
OPINIONS, or those of some other atheist cretin.. that countries like
the USA, which Prints "In God We Trust" on it's money, is in any way
such a murderous tyranny, torturing terrorising and murdering over
20,000,000 of it's citizens!
Off you go you snivelling atheist fraud!
Post by email@example.com
"Higher rates of non-theism and acceptance of human evolution usually
correlate with lower rates of dysfunction, and the least theistic
nations are usually the least dysfunctional"
So these atheist traitors maintain that the United States, Australia
and European nations are all MORE DYSFUNCTIONAL than the USSR with the
Red Terror, and Mao's China with the Red Guards, each of which tortured,
terrorised and murdered over 20,000,000 people!!
Pull the other one, you lying atheist holocaust denier!
Hey Atheists, if you don't like livign here, why don't you all FUCK OFF
TO A NICE ATHEIST SHITHOLE, LIKE Nth KOREA...
You don't have too many other choices, as all of the other Atheist
regimes were complete Cluster Fucks, and are consigned to the dustbin
..go join them! B^)
# "State atheism is the official promotion of atheism
# by a government, typically by active suppression of
# religious freedom and practice."
# - "Protest for Religious Rights in the USSR:
# Characteristics and Consequences,
# David Kowalewski,
# Russian Review, Vol. 39, No. 4 (Oct., 1980), pp. 426-441,
# "An atheist, Pol Pot suppressed Cambodia’s Buddhist religion:
# monks were defrocked; temples and artifacts, including statues of
# Buddha, were destroyed; and people praying or expressing
# other religious sentiments were often killed.
# ...the government emptied the cities through mass evacuations
# and sent people to the countryside. Cambodians were overworked
# and underfed on collective farms, often succumbing to disease or
# starvation as a result. Spouses were separated and family meals
# prohibited in order to steer loyalties toward the state
# instead of the family.
# About 1.7 million Cambodians, or about 20 percent of the population,
# were worked, starved, or beaten to death under Pol Pot’s regime."
# - http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761579038/pol_pot.html
# The Cambodian Genocide:Loading Image...
# "The country's 40,000 to 60,000 Buddhist monks,
# regarded by the regime as social parasites,
# were defrocked and forced into labor brigades.
# Many monks were executed; temples and pagodas were
# destroyed or turned into storehouses or jails.
# Images of the Buddha were defaced and dumped into
# rivers and lakes. People who were discovered praying
# or expressing religious sentiments in other ways
# were often killed.
# The Christian and Muslim communities were among the most
# persecuted, as well. The Roman Catholic cathedral of
# Phnom Penh was completely razed.
# The Khmer Rouge forced Muslims to eat pork, which they
# regard as an abomination. Many of those who refused were killed.
# Christian clergy and Muslim imams were executed."
# - http://countrystudies.us/cambodia/29.htm
# "Forty-eight percent of Cambodia's Christians were killed
# because of their religion."
# "the state established atheism as the only scientific truth."
# - Daniel Peris,
# "Storming the Heavens: The Soviet League of the Militant Godless"
# Cornell University Press 1998 ISBN 9780801434853
# "State atheism has been mostly implemented in communist
# countries, such as the former Soviet Union, China,
# Communist Albania, Communist Afghanistan, North Korea,
# Communist Mongolia and Poland under communist rule also
# promoted state atheism and suppressed religion.
# - Forced out: the fate of Polish Jewry in Communist Poland.
# Wolak, Arthur J. p 104
# In these nations, the governments viewed atheism as an
# intrinsic part of communist ideology.